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Oldbowler

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Reply with quote  #31 
Quote:
Originally Posted by avabob
The problem is everwhere is different . Certainly cant fault the measures taken in NY. I think initial response in WA made sense, but now we are sitting in a county of 500K with less tha 20 people even in the hospital. 75% of all reported cases have already recovered. Yet we are still on Phase 1.


Pull up a map of the states by what party the governor is affiliated with..  Interesting to see.

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avabob

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Reply with quote  #32 
There is more a correlation with population densitiesm. Dems tend to be governors of more populous states. History may show that there was an over reaction or not.
themrfreeze

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Reply with quote  #33 
This is a problem that needs to be solved at the state level.  The federal government has shown that they can't effectively deal with the crisis and breaking things up geographically, even within a state, will allow for more effective monitoring and relaxing of restrictions where appropriate.  Some governors have shown great leadership during this crisis, some have shown ineptitude, and these traits are not falling along party lines.  

Here in NY the state has been separated into 7 regions, each with a regional "manager" who will oversee its reopening.  Each region has to meet 7 criteria to begin the reopening process and there are 4 phases of reopening.  I'm in the Finger Lakes region where the number of infections was modest so we've entered stage 1 reopening...it's pretty limited but it's a start.  I literally just heard that the governor is allowing public gatherings of up to 10 people if social distancing and masks are in use, so I guess this means Parkview can hosts a singles league now.   😉

Once the emergency passes I have no doubt that we'll hear some people claim that the shutdowns were an overreaction or unnecessary.  It would be great if there was a way to accurately count the number of lives saved by the shutdown so we could shut those people up, but all the experts can do is estimate.  Last number I heard was that if we didn't shut down, 2 million Americans would have died.  [eek]
mrbowling300

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Reply with quote  #34 
Michigan extended our stay at home until June 12
mrbowling300

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Reply with quote  #35 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTbowling
I have completely changed my mind about this. I was all in favor of shutting everything down...until I learned that there might never be a vaccine. If that's the case, and we keep slowing everything with this social distancing routine, this will be how it is for the rest of all of our lives. 

If that's the case, just open everything up and encourage everyone to get it so we can get it over with. If we die, we die. Life as it currently is is not worth it. 


Shutting down was all about saving lives and preventing the health care system from becoming overwhelmed. I believe there will be a vaccine someday, it will take some time. We will learn to live with it until then. Here in Michigan, like NY, we are split into 8 regions. Two are now open, with restaurants opening at 50% capacity, offices, etc. The metro detroit area will be the last to open. I think the governor has done a good job managing this, under tough and uncertain circumstances. She has been relying on the scientific data to make her decisions, all of which has not been popular with everyone. The goal is to survive and from the sounds of it, you do not want this virus. I've known two to come down with it. I'm sure we will get to the other side of this eventually. And when we do, I sure cannot wait to bowl!!!
Bob_DeDowney

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Reply with quote  #36 
I don't want this to become a Political argument so I won't mention that because of so many conflicting reports and
statements being reversed there seems to be a lot of politicizing of this virus.
Oldbowler

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Reply with quote  #37 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTbowling
I have completely changed my mind about this. I was all in favor of shutting everything down...until I learned that there might never be a vaccine. If that's the case, and we keep slowing everything with this social distancing routine, this will be how it is for the rest of all of our lives. 

If that's the case, just open everything up and encourage everyone to get it so we can get it over with. If we die, we die. Life as it currently is is not worth it. 


I'm just guessing here, but it would seem you are relatively young.  I am not.  My wife has cancer and her immune system is compromised, in addition to having COPD and asthma.  I am doing everything I can to protect her from the people with the attitude you seem to have.  I have to go out to buy supplies, go to my Dr. appts and take her to hers.  There is banking to be done.  In addition to that, we are raising 7 and 9 year old grand daughters.  Do you have any idea how hard it is to explain to them why some people just don't care about keeping other people safe from this virus?  When we see folks blatantly ignoring social distancing, not wearing masks, gathering in bunches, I have to tell them we are following the rules to protect Grandma.  Their reply, "Don't those people have grandparents too?"  Life is always worth living.

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themrfreeze

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Reply with quote  #38 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTbowling


We need 60-70% to get it for "herd immunity." If they don't come up with a vaccine (and there still aren't any for the other SARS-type viruses), that's going to take the rest of our lives at the current rate of infection. 



The SARS/MERS outbreaks that took place 15-20 years ago were not worldwide pandemics, they were regional issues that were ultimately eradicated.  Covid is a worldwide pandemic and thus the number of organizations working on developing a vaccine (including the university I work for) is huge.  Whether an actual definitive vaccine is developed for it like it was for measles or mumps, I have no idea.  But a vaccine that can keep it under control like we have for influenza is almost certainly going to happen.  If we have that, and we can get close to 100% of the population vaccinated, we'll be okay.

One of my larger concerns has to do with the anti-vaxxer movement.  I would think the current situation is enough proof for them that they need to rethink their stance on vaccinations, but you know the die-hard anti-vaxxers won't get a Covid vaccination once it's developed.  The question is how do you deal with the threat posed by those who refuse to get vaccinated for Covid?  Do we call herd immunity "good enough" or do we insist everybody gets vaccinated and somehow punish those who don't?



 
Oldbowler

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Reply with quote  #39 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTbowling


We don't have a choice. Without a vaccine, this is a war, and some of us have to die. My parents are in their late 60s. But I don't even see them now because of this shit. 

Some people are OK with spending the rest of their lives indoors, never going to a crowded area again, and being almost completely socially isolated. I'm not. This is not a life worth living for me. 


I am sorry you feel that way.  I am a 70 year old combat vet.  I don't go to crowded areas, or eat out in crowded restaurants, haven't gone to a movie theater in 20 years, don't live in a crowded city......all by choice. I live in a rural area of a central US state with moderate rules to live by, and own 4 1/2 acres with a pond, 5 dogs, 2 horses and a cat.  We go outside whenever we want, to sit on the porch, shoot in our shooting lane, or chase the neighbors cows out of our pasture after they cross the pond.  I can't imagine living any other way.  If you are stuck in a big city, or Michigan, I guess I could feel differently about it.  My family is alive and healthy considering our ages.  I wish the best for you.  Please don't let this drive you to anything rash.

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Dare

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Reply with quote  #40 
Just what we need to break the monotony of the virus.....looting and rioting
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Oldbowler

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Reply with quote  #41 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dare
Just what we need to break the monotony of the virus.....looting and rioting


At least with Cicero, Watts and LA, it was localized.  Now it's nationwide.  George Soros has really come through this time.

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themrfreeze

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Reply with quote  #42 
The looting (at least in our area) is being done by anarchists who aren't even from our area.  One of the guys arrested last night had Pennsylvania license plates (and we're in upstate NY).  Kinda sounds like they organized themselves to join peaceful demonstrations so they'd have the opportunity to get violent.
Oldbowler

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Reply with quote  #43 
There is a company called “Crowds on Demand” (likely one of several or even many), who, at the behest of their clients, hire people to perform actions asked for. These actions include adding bodies (numbers) to protests as well as rioting. They are advertising for rioters right now.
This is no longer heartfelt, moral outrage. This is straight from the manua
l of how to destroy this country, seed hatred and set race relations back 100 years.

The above is from a friend of mine.  That's all I have to say on the topic.


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mrbowling300

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Reply with quote  #44 
What you are saying wouldnt surprise me, if true.
Dare

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Reply with quote  #45 
https://crowdsondemand.com/
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